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Welcome to the People and Projects Podcast where you'll find interviews and insights on how to deliver projects and lead teams!

Nov 20, 2021

Leading in an Ecosystem

We’re continuing a series of episodes on the topic of change. Back in episode 339 we talked with Katy Milkman about her book How to Change, which provided some helpful insights into the behavioral science of change.

But what if you are planning to lead a change initiative. Beyond what Katy brought us from behavioral science, I wanted to bring you a process—something that is practical, memorable, and tested across industries. And I’m glad to say I found it!

In this episode I’m excited to introduce you to Gary Lloyd, author of Gardeners Not Mechanics: How to Cultivate Change at Work. I’m not a gardener but I find Gary’s approach to be practical for changes you want to lead at work and in your personal life. I can’t wait to share the discussion with you.

Learn more about Gary at


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Talent Triangle: Leadership


Funky Corporation by chilledmusic

It's Funky by Frank Schröter

Googly Eyes Gardener by Saturday Night Live is available on YouTube at